Where should python development discussions move to?

The way I understand the categories here, they mirror the existing mailing lists… except for python-dev which doesn’t seem to have a corresponding category here. For example, where should we informally discuss PEPs? (I really mean actual PEPs here, not ideas for a new PEP)

As I mentioned on python-committers and mirrored here, during the core sprint in Redmond we decided to try out Discourse in earnest due to many problems that we face with mailing lists.


I felt like inviting members of python-committers to dive deep and test it out until the end of the year provides both the test volume we need, as well as is great timing (since an elevated volume of discussion will happen due to the governance situation). Most people seem to agree with this as the list of committers here is already 54 strong. So expect much of the discussion that would go to python-committers to actually go here now.

Note that there are a few core developers who reject the Discourse idea, or at least the style in which I communicated it. By their absence here I assume they will stick to using python-committers.

Other mailing lists

Anybody can sign up on Discourse today but I would like the initial test to be done by core developers to make sure the platform fits our needs. In the original announcement I planned for the month of October to be that initial period of identifying any deal breakers.

I thought of inviting python-dev subscribers to move in November, and python-list and -ideas in December.

For python-dev specifically, I did not create a category for that as many of the active core developers are upset with how it turned out (20+ thousand subscribers with drive-by comments, hard to figure out who is who, confused users asking for Python usage help). Discussions that non-committers open on python-dev today would simply happen in Users. If we start seeing too much volume in that bucket, we can create sub-categories, “Open PEP Discussion” being a likely one we’ll want.

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It seems to me that this would only make the situation worse (more posts in a single category), not better.

Almost all open-source projects have different “users” and “developers” mailing lists. So I don’t see why we shouldn’t do this on discuss.python.org also.

The main thing that I’m worried about is that non-core developers will be heard less. Either because core developers decide to discuss development on “Committers” or because core developers won’t check “Users” because it’s just a bunch of newbies asking questions.

Please don’t make it harder for non-core developers to get involved in Python development.

This is why I think we’ll grow a list of sub-categories and the moderators will keep moving posts around when needed. But I think it’s best to let it grow organically while Discourse starts being used more.

Don’t worry, the goal is exactly the opposite. On Discourse there is one platform where all people have to have accounts. It’s easy for anybody to mention developers by name. There will be those of us in the core team who will read the entire firehose, and those who only react when notified. Either is fine.

In the end, I’m not married to the idea of never having “Developers” as a main category. If my current intuitions and suggestions will prove inadequate, we will fix it. You can hold me accountable for that.

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